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Roy:
I am glade you took the story in fun. I am well aware of the problems with teak decks. We are fortunate, the decks on IDUNA were repaid and all the bungs have been kept in sound condition as evident by the lack of staining around the bungs. I have "opened" the decks via the two deck prisms and where the mast ring goes through the deck. The balsa core color is white and very sound. I have also removed all of the interior deck panels when I re-wired the boat and noted no indicators of leaks or any seeping. The bronze stanchions on our boat are bolted through solid fiberglass. All fittings and hardware are bronze. The blocks are wood and were made in Lunenburg, Nova Scotia. The hull has been insulated with 3/4" polyurethane closed cell foam. This is glass over and lines the hull proper.
We had rebuilt our last boat, a custom built aft-cabin Flicka, hence have completed our "degrees" in boat mucking. She is in the Seattle area now.
A plywood core maybe stronger than balsa cored decks but leaks can lead to rot which spreads through plywood faster than balsa core. Unfortunately, there is not a perfect building material for boats. The key is good maintenance regardless of the building material. The current practice for laying a teak deck over fiberglass is epoxy bonding. These decks start to debond after about 4 to 5 years. The key to teak decking is stay on top of the maintenance. I have seen rotted decks in all sorts of boats. An excellent surveyor in our area believes the best method to hold a teak deck in place is still polysulfide and mechanical fastenings.
IDUNA was built well by her first owners - Peter and Erica Thinnus. Based on the joiner work and the thought that went into the layout, this was not their first boat. He sold the boat after a year and built a large steel boat, then went cruising. IDUNA was well taken care of by her previous owners. I would not have purchased the boat if this were not the case.
It is my understanding, the early SLM BCC's had their problems where the wood bulwark stanchions passed through the deck. They also had problems with the whale strake boards. I believe some of the early SLM BCC's had teak decks over fiberglass. I suspect there are few SLM BCC's out there with soft decks. At this point in time, it does not matter, there are well maintained boats and poorly maintained boats regardless of who built them.
Sometimes I am a little sensitive about remarks/rumors made about Canadian BCC's. I suspect Ed McNeil, the owner of Channel Cutter Yachts, was, if I may be polite, in the boat building game for only the money, as were many owners when boat building companies were many in the 1970's and 1980's, just ask the Nor'sea 27 folks. Unfortunately, rumors without foundation spread. Rumors and unfounded statements do not help the market price of well built and well maintained Canadian BCC's. I once asked Lin Pardey about Canadian built BCC's. Her comment was, she understood they were built better than the SLM BCC's. I suspect, this was just a repeat of hearsay. I do not know and it does not matter. What I do know is, we have a good boat and as is always the case, should we decide to sell her, no matter what is said and done, the boat must stand along and pass survey. This is the case for all boats regardless of the make or model.
If I may make a request, can we move on to other business than attempting to compare CCY BCC's to the SLM BCC's. This forum is one of the best advertisements for SLM and as such, let us try to help SLM, so Sumio will have some new boats to build.
Fair Winds,
Rod
S/V IDUNA
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Bob:Your question is well founded. My reference to Nor'sea was in reqard to Bob Eeg and several judgements against him - see below. This information was originally from a former Nor'sea 27 owner who cruised his boat for 16 years. My friend had a Dean Wixom built boat. This cases as referenced below, occurred at a later time, certainly not when Dean Wixom ran the company.If I worded the sentence wrong or offended you, my apologies.Fair Winds,
Rod
Nor'Sea Sailboat Buyer's Guide
I paid Mr. Robert Eeg in full for a new Nor'Sea 27 sailboat. He never delivered the sailboat and kept all the money as profit. I sued Mr. Robert Eeg for breach of contract and fraud. In 1995, I obtained a court judgment for breach of contract only (not fraud) from Mr. Robert Eeg for $74,451.50. As of today, August 14, 2002, he has not paid me one penny towards satisfying the judgment. Reason for judgment for breach of contract: non-delivery of boat. More Judgments Against Robert Eeg: California Public Records
from - http://www.norsea27.com
…And After Sundance, There Was Windsong (by Tom Gannon of PS) from:
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Rod
Please explain how boat builders of the Norsea 27 were in it only for the We would all be interested in your “expert” knowledge. All of us ‘Nor’Sea 27 Folks’ would like to hear the facts; “If I may be polite”… Bob Rod Bruckdorfer wrote:
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Rod
you seem to have only read part of the story.
http://www.practical-slander.com/index.html There are two sides to every story. An expert like you should be more careful Rod Bruckdorfer wrote:
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Just goes to show; you'll never find a more opinionated lot than a room full of blow boaters.
Add a case of beer then stand back and watch the fur fly.
This never was about quality or international relations. Rather, it is about legality and the business ethics
of an unknown party who doesn't have a problem bootlegging intellectual property and his unfortunate
customers who were just trying to save a buck.
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Everyone: when I right click on this email to find out who "Bob" might be, the email address that shows up is bobeeg@earthlink.net . What a funny coincidence.
SV MINX
Roy Myers
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In addition, if you look at the Yahoo alias for this person, you will
see an alarming name. Sir, I would ask that you change that name.
It would be so unfortunate if this is the same person who makes the
Nor’Sea.
-Will
— In bcc@yahoogroups.com , “Roy Myers” <myersroy_e@h…> wrote:
Everyone: when I right click on this email to find out who “Bob”
might be, the email address that shows up is bobeeg@e… What a
funny coincidence.SV MINX
Roy Myers
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob
To: bcc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 7:37 PM
Subject: Re: [bcc] Canadian vs. SLMRod
you seem to have only read part of the story.http://www.practical-slander.com/index.html
There are two sides to every story. An expert like you should be
more careful when he slams people.Rod Bruckdorfer wrote:
Bob:
Your question is well founded. My reference to Nor’sea was in
reqard to Bob Eeg and several judgements against him - see below.
This information was originally from a former Nor’sea 27 owner who
cruised his boat for 16 years. My friend had a Dean Wixom built
boat. This cases as referenced below, occurred at a later time,
certainly not when Dean Wixom ran the company.
If I worded the sentence wrong or offended you, my apologies.
Fair Winds,
RodNor’Sea Sailboat Buyer’s Guide
If you are about to buy a boat from Nor’Sea, consider this your
lucky day. Many of us were not so fortunate.I paid Mr. Robert Eeg in full for a new Nor’Sea 27 sailboat. He
never delivered the sailboat and kept all the money as profit. I sued
Mr. Robert Eeg for breach of contract and fraud. In 1995, I obtained
a court judgment for breach of contract only (not fraud) from Mr.
Robert Eeg for $74,451.50. As of today, August 14, 2002, he has not
paid me one penny towards satisfying the judgment.A judgment exists against Robert Eeg of Nor’Sea, builder of
the Nor’Sea 27 sailboat.Reason for judgment for breach of contract: non-delivery of
boat.More Judgments Against Robert Eeg: California Public Records
Dr. Glen Justice gets a new Nor’Sea 27 from Nor’Sea “for less
than cost” according to Bob Eeg. Read Dr. Glen Justice’s story about
what really happened.“Here is a photo of Jim Montgomery’s Nor’Sea 27. I sold Jim
this boat January 10, 1992. It was a boat that was fully equipped and
ready for sea.” Read Bob Eeg’s Big Lie .See articles in “Practical Sailor” about Nor’Sea and owner
Robert Eeg. – back issues available: call Practical Sailor at (203)
661-6111.
1… October 15, 1994 (Volume 20, Number 20) " Alive But Not
Well: Nor’Sea Marine "
2… July 15, 1995 (Volume 21, Number 14) " Nor’Sea Still
Under Siege "
Quote from Tom Gannon, reporter for “Practical Sailor,” in
reference to Robert Eeg of Nor’Sea: “I have never before seen fraud
of this magnitude in the boating industry.”from - http://www.norsea27.com
.And After Sundance, There Was Windsong (by Tom Gannon of
PS)
Frederick Booth (see main story) says that after Nor’Sea
failed to deliver Sundance, a factory trade in, or build him a new
27, Eeg offered him another demo, Windsong, describing it as “factory
new” with a launch date of April 10, 1993. “It’s rare we have a boat
in stock,” the flyer continued, adding, “No waiting.” [I saw this flyer too - Jim]In fact, Gene Bleasedale of Glen Ellen, California had
been waiting for that particular boat since 1989. “It’s a tragic
story, like the others,” Bleasedale began his account to PS.
According to Bleasedale, he and his wife visited the Nor’Sea factory
in 1988 in search of a boat. He said Eeg promised them “he could put
a boat together in three months, no problem.” A month later,
Bleasedale paid $1,000 to reserve a boat and to be locked into 1988
prices. Over the next months, he said, he “doled out” payments to
Nor’Sea, eventually putting up about $70,000. He spent another
$6,000 for a trailer he had shipped to the plant and about $12,000
for other gear, primarily electronics.Bleasedale says now his mistake was in asking for
optional work to be done without getting a firm price or completion
date. In 1991, after many delays, he said Eeg told him. “I need
$12,0000 to finish your boat.” The price tag later rose to $19,000
and finally Bleasedale was informed by Eeg that he’d borrowed $60,000
to finish the boat and that there was a lien for that amount against
it. In his last conversation with Eeg, he said, "He told me I had no
interest (claim) in the boat. “We were going to call it Encantadora
(Enchantress).” Eeg named it Windsong.Fred Booth was not the only unhappy customer to be
offered a chance to own Windsong. Jim Montgomery, who says Eeg sold
a new 27 that he’d been promised (and had paid for) [Eeg confessed to
this in court - Jim], offered him the boat in 1993 as a
replacement. “Give me $25,000 and I’ll put your hull number on it,”
he quoted Eeg as saying. Montgomery said his lawyer advised against
it. In fact, the title to this boat, like that of Sundance, was not
completely clear. Eeg had taken a $60,000 loan against it from Ganis
(in December of 1991, as a new boat). The loan is outstanding. When
last seen, Windsong , vintage uncertain, was in the water at Dana
Point.from:
http://www.norsea27.com/Genes_story/index.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob
To:bcc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2003 12:22 AM
Subject: Re: [bcc] Canadian vs. SLMRod
Please explain how boat builders of the Norsea 27 were in it
only for the money. (you say in the 70s and 80s…)We would all be interested in your “expert” knowledge.
All of us ‘Nor’Sea 27 Folks’ would like to hear the
facts; “If I may be polite”…Bob
Rod Bruckdorfer wrote:
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Folks,
Thank you for your thoughts on the differences between the two versions of BCCs my concerns have now been put to rest. I knew a was risking opening a proverbial Pandoras Box by asking, and on that thought Im now asking that we end this tread & move on.
If anyone still has anything else they wish to share with me on this subject please email me directly, my email address is in the database.
Again thank you! Rick Snider S/V Aistear #7
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Bob: Hi!
Do you happen to have a copy of the February 1977
issue of Cruising World?
That’s the issue that has Chuck Malseed’s article on
Lyle Hess, the same article that is on the Nor’Sea
website at
http://www.norseayachts.com/lylehess_a_profile.html.
In the same issue of Cruising World, there’s an
article ‘Down the Ways’ about Sam L Morse and the BCC.
I’m very interesting in reading the article, but I’ve
not been able to find a copy.
Cheers
Bil
BCC28 #116
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